Doug Greene Interview about Glaucoma, Rabbit Holes & Bucket LIsts

i’m your host Ana Acton. Today on
disability rap we’re going to be talking with Doug Greene. Doug has worked as a
photojournalist, author and web developer with editorial work in The New York times, Backpacker Magazine and Photo District News among others. He is
an avid motorcyclist and he’s trying to raise awareness for for glaucoma. So I’d like to start today by just
welcoming you to the show Doug. Thank you for coming to the studio to Nevada City
today. Thank you very much. It’s a pleasure to be here. You live right down the
hill in Auburn? Right down the hill … just slide right into it. And of course Nevada City is one of your favorite towns. It is! I really liked Nevada City a city a lot. It’s got a nice combination of community
and architecture and arts and all that stuff. All those wonderful reasons that
we we live here. Indeed. Or close by at least. Well
thank you for coming on the show today It’s a pleasure to to get to meet
you and have a chance to talk with you a little bit before the show. We are going
to have a lot I think to go over today in an hour and I really would like to
just start by letting the listeners know a little bit about yourself. Who are you? Who’s Doug Greene? Yeah … maybe I can give a quick snapshot of the part is especially relevant to what we’re
talking about today. I’ve always been a content person and I’ve been a very
visual person. i graduated from Sac City (College) and then San Jose State in journalism and photojournalism. And i worked as a writer, photographer, editor, photo editor,
information architect, web developer content developer for online stuff. And
now i do videography – mostly marketing videos. But a very visual world –
I think visually, I take in the world visually … … I’m just I’m a visual person.
And it was eight years ago that i started noticing like things just
“weren’t there” in my vision. It was weird. There was no pain, there was
nothing like alarming that you know just jumped in and aid, “Go get checked!” So I went into an opthamologist up in Reno when I was visiting a friend up there. And the
test came back – you know that visual field test? – and he looked at me and said
“You need to get your eyes checked fast by a specialist.” So i was living in Marin
County at the time and I went to see a specialist there. And i’ll never forget
the moment – they start that test and you’re looking at what looks like a
white salad bowl turned on its side and you’re looking straight ahead a dot, and
then there’s little flashes of light that they . all over the thing almost
like being in a planetarium maybe. And you’re supposed to hit a little mouse button
every time you see the the light flash. And so the woman turns on the machine,
leaves, and I’m supposed to be clicking the button. Except I’m not seeing any little
lights. So I said “you wanna turn this thing on?” And she said “It IS on.” And there was like that little faint thing like, “No, I don’t
think she did.” So she came back and you look down at it and said, “See, it’s on.” She starts pointing to flashes. And then finally I start seeing a couple bright ones. So i said well
maybe you get started over so she does and the same thing was happening I
wasn’t seeing hardly any flashes finally I said you know maybe it’s the drops you
put in my I maybe can we do this tomorrow and she says okay so I came
back the next day same experience wasn’t seeing much she checked both eyes and
she was like quiet when she left I mean cheeks obviously knew something i didn’t
know and she said the doctor will see you in
a momentarily so I go in to see the doc and he lays these charts out in front of
me and I could just see by the look in his face that something was really not
good here and he said when was the last time you had your vision checked and i
was probably 7-8 years ago and he said well let me explain these charts and he
turns them over and basically they’re like two circles and they’re either
they’re filled in with black and he said if if you have perfect vision there
would be no black in here and i looked at the left eye and half of the circle
was black and parts of the rest of it and in the right either was just a
little hole left in the center and he said where it’s lighter and here’s where
you can still see basically what it meant was I’d lost ninety percent of the
vision in my right eye and half of my left and he said that vision is gone
forever there’s nothing you can do to get that
back this is beyond anything I can help you with you need to go see an expert
and he said there’s nobody in in marin county that can help you you’re either
going to have to go to San Francisco or sonoma and I liked us at Sonoma said
yeah there’s in sonoma there was a doctor yeah it’s I didn’t want to deal
with San Francisco was just too big to just you know I’ve never like big cities
and there was a doctor there named sonia schlueter who had just recently moved
back from New Mexico where she was working on she’s an incredible doctor I’ve I can’t
say enough good things about her anyway thanks to her and yeah I still have some
vision lot but when she when she saw the vision you want to have your pressures
under 20 in your eye and it’s you know think of it like that your tire pressure
they use a different unit but anything over 20 is not good mine had been at 54 years and years what happens in glaucoma is your eyeball
inflates almost like a water balloon and where the optical nerve exits the I if
there’s too much pressure to get script and it’s like cream you know taking
wires and crimping them they start to to break in the case of your optical nerve
this sells the neuron cells start to Ganga ladies call they die off and it’s
like taking out your vision one pixel at a time on a monitor and it starts on the
outside works its way you so most people don’t even notice it until it’s too late
and that’s my good Karma’s called the silence stealer of light the silent
sealer of light yeah and so you had had your eyes
checked out seven to eight years prior to this experience so this whole process
of using ninety percent of your your sight in one eye and fifty or so percent
and the other i took place over a seven or eight year period yeah do you believe yeah maybe even less
than there and you have you didn’t even you were not consciously aware i know
there’s no pain there’s no it’s not like it’s there’s a big contrast between you
know a seven-day it’s just one cell at a time like one grain of sand a time being
outed to something you just don’t notice it because it happens so gradually yeah
there’s no physical sensations to warn you of something like losing feeling
somewhere something so so then here you are in sonoma at the specialist for your
eyesight and she says what so she says man so she says I don’t think we can
save your right are the left I we might be able to and you know Chief those are hard words to hear bad and I
really i mean you know we’ll talk about depression here I went down the I went
down the rabbit hole there you know to varying degrees there was like kind of
down the hole once up a little bit down again deeper deeper deeper she to her credit was well a she’s an
incredible dr. her mom had been a glaucoma specialist too so she was a
second-generation coma expert on she said we’re going to do the drops and you
know she can explain what glaucoma is how it works kind of the strategies she also said there are other things you
can do beyond this including them better diet cardio exercise believe it or not
where you get your blood pumping it actually makes sense if you push if you
do intense exercise and get your blood pumping it gets into those micro
arteries serving the I so I’ve always been an internist cardio person anyway
but I definitely upped it continues running in fact right near where I live
there’s a hell called cardiac elegance down into the American River Canyon you
visited that he’ll a lot still do i do it twice them twice a week nice so there’s so she explained you
know so talk a little bit about the treatment for lock glaucoma welcome so I
have what a normal typical glaucoma which is caused by pressure in the game
the name of the game is to reduce the pressure and you basically have three
lines of defense for doing that the first is eye drops and if i had
started doing i drop seven or eight years ago or seven eight years be prior
to diagnosis I would have been fine could have been managed and I have
probably you know 99 percent chance i could get normal vision throughout my
life but because we lost so much my ride is message is hanging by a thread we had
to go to a pretty aggressive stance so the first line of defense is eye drops i
do three different eye drops three times a day that worked for about three years
and then my ride i started to the pressure started going back up and
meanwhile like sometimes I’m switching through different medications because i
had an allergic reaction to one they lose their efficacy after a while the next line of defense is blasting
your eye with a laser they actually kinda hit the mesh area in the eye I don’t know that they even know why it
works but it seems to reduce pressure little bit just one two or three points
not actually worked for about a year and then they started going up again so the
third line of defense so first you have the eye drops then you
have the laser treatment the third one is to do with a college herb a colectomy
and what they do is basically put a hole in your eye from the inside of the eye
to the outside of the eye if you can imagine almost like a pressure cooker
top it’s a way that when your eye gets too much pressure in it it can leak out
it can release the pressure and so I had that done and at the same time you also
put a new lens in my eye because that can happen so that’s cataract surgery so
I cataract and trabeculectomy surgery at the same time and that’s worked i still
use drops in that I but i only have to use a one drop twice the day and that I
and the pressures of state around 15-16 even as low as 14 which is nice I’m so that’s it you know you’ve got the
eye drops and then you got the laser and then you got the trabeculectomy at some
point i’ll have to have that done on my left eye to sew and and this is
something that’s genetic it is right it’s not in all cases but
much of the time it is and as it turns out it is in our family unfortunately I don’t even know what
glaucoma was that have been something that it had been mindful of you know how
my radar screen I would have been testing for it and and
the importance of getting your eyes checked on an annual basis right yeah
because it sounds like once the damage is done it’s done it’s done all they can
really do a treatment is to keep it from getting worse right that’s the only game
we have right so we’re talking with green and his experience with glaucoma
Doug when you heard the news and you realize that you had lost majority of
your eyesight what was I mean there’s there’s the
treatment there’s the you know trying to pursue that but you know what i mean
there’s this whole internal discussion that goes on and and the grief that
comes along with los can you talk are you going to talk about the analyst
let’s done and I mean it’sit’s something actually talk about now too I speak for Placer County about
depression and suicide and drama and my books about it and all of that so
there’s the five stages of grief what is something something five stages of grief yeah you know there’s denial anger i’m
gonna forget the order here but I you know kind of like let’s make a deal and
then you go into depression and then finally at the end of that is acceptance
but I went through the first three or four pretty fast and I just went
straight into depression and you know this is a whole other topic there’s the thing itself and then
there’s a response to it and my response to it was depression but it’s typical I
mean this hands for you know I had a spinal cord injury I went through a
similar experience people experience grief and loss in so many different ways
in their lives yeah so you know your experience well it
was unique to you is also something that i think a lot of listeners at one time
or another have probably gone through or we’ll go through unfortunately whether
it’s a loss of a loved one or a personal loss to disability yeah it’s it’s a universal theme out
there for sure yeah how we get there you know we have
our own journey to it but we all seem to you know i like to call it going down
the rabbit hole uh-huh but it’s a whole the thing I can
say about depression is I heard a speaker say this once suicide is a real place it is a place
where it is dark there’s a reason they call it a whole
when I fell down I lost sight of that kind of place where I fell in you know
that whole of light up above and I kept sliding down deeper and
deeper and my world . tighter and smaller and darker i was fortunate that
I had some friends and marin that reach down and one friend even put together
what she called a suicide policy for mamak I got to the point where I really
wanted to check out took me two years to get there so two years post-diagnosis
yeah I kept sliding deeper and deeper and night you know in that time I lost
my home I lost my investments because I just didn’t care anymore and it got
darker and darker and it was just I had an experience where I felt this was the
turning point it’s almost like there’s two energies in this there’s a life
energy in the death of energy life is a pretty high vibration I mean
if we simplify it in my experience it’s life is like this hi-brite vibration and death is lower
deep dark vibration and I was kind of caught in between them and I was still
trying to you know life energies pretty strong but I had an experience where I
felt the hand of death reach out to me I mean it was a real visceral experience
of the hand of death reaching out to me and I reached back for it and I felt the
deepest piece I’d ever known and in that moment I decide I want to die I don’t want to put up with this pain
this internal pain anymore and at that point I made my plans and I knew how I
was going to go I knew where I was going to go the question was when and when was
really dependent upon getting my stuff my you know my exit strategy in order
like getting my will done and getting rid of my stuff and sort of cataloging
all my photos and getting them digitized and leaving instructions for people on
the you know once i exited and I was I so comfortable with this so
that dark energy had really pulled me in and it was peaceful and i gotta say I no
longer fear death in fact I maybe have too much of a
comfort level with it but life had other plans that’s a powerful story I mean that’s a powerful place to be you
know in your life what was the turning point i mean at
what point was there a glimmer of light the life vibration at what point were
you able to your wedding that you can call it life operation there was
something on now I guess maybe it was I that’s a good question what it was was a
voice they came from both within me and outside of me something bigger than me
i’m not religious i’m not going to say God but higher self higher place you
know a great spirit whatever a voice came through and it said do your bucket
list do your bucket list and I looked up I
mean literally I looked up in the air like what the bucket list and one of the
things I’ve noticed and I’ve also talked with others about this is even when
you’re in that darkest of places and seeming insanity of suicide there are
still logic going on and I I mean this bucket list thing like was big and the
logic was if I check out I can’t do my bucket list all right but if I do my bucket list I
can still check out it was literally that simple and but I had another
problem the first item on that bucket list I’ve always been a whitewater
kayaker not always but I had been for 30 years and I was a big part of my life
and the first bucket list items to kayak down the Grand Canyon now in North
America others you know there’s there’s great trips and there are great trips
right and the Grand Canyon white doing I’ve rafting trip kayaking trip down the
Grand Canyon is considered one of the greatest like the holy grail it’s
certainly one of the right and the friends of mine that it done it
described moving into something called River time is when you’re on the Ritz a
three-week trip on a private trip when we did it and they talked about moving
out of sort of are you know human constructed time things in time
constraints of we know work and play you know are sort of regimented world
are moving into a more natural way of being natural time because you’re a
doors you’re dependent upon when the Sun rises when the sunsets you’re on the
river you’ve got kind of set things you’re doing and so I knew I had to do
that trip the problem was it was a 15-year wait for hate to do a private
trip looks like we have a problem here so okay so bucket list just real quick
you it you know in the depths of grief and sorrow ends in with a plan for
suicide know you have this idea that you need to do your bucket list and if you
do your bucket you know if you do if you die you can’t do your bucket list so
let’s at least try to do the bucket list before yeah and so through how many items were
on your bike so you the first one so the grand canyon there are 3 items on the
first one and they really they popped right out right then and there first
once kayak down the Grand Canyon yeah second one was stood ride was
called the Continental Divide ride which is $TIME a.m. it’s a motorcycle trip for Mexico to
Canada or Canada to Mexico which depending which direction to go but on
dirt roads remote dirt roads all along the Continental Divide and it’s about is
2700 miles of dirt and I wanted to do it solo and I wanted a mom so that was that
and then the third one is to ride a motorcycle on what’s called the
pan-american anyway which is from Prudhoe Bay Alaska
to Tierra del Fuego Argentina Wow president we don’t care what you go
big yea big or go home right yeah but go bigger check out right so
the first of the bucket list is going down the Grand Canyon kayaking the Grand
Canyon yeah but you have a 15-year wait yeah at
that time I was a 15-year way to get a permit so that’s when about a week after
that bucket list thing knocks me over the head a friend from Nevada City actually Tom
my notes calls me up and says dog is a kayaking buddy of mine tom says a dog a
hickey know that Grand Canyon permit i put in for 15 years ago the phone like
this can’t be happening oh my gosh I just got it we’re putting in on in putting on in two
months do you want to go and high and i’m kinda joking i remember the size
like oh my god there’s something bigger than me happening here and of course the
light yes I haven’t had me not that trip I was
the first person II personally ass and obviously the first person that said
yeah and he brought together an incredible group of people i mean a
grand canyon trip can really go about if you got the wrong people because your
group that has to work together you pack rafts together you break them down you
set up camp you cook together you’ve gotta work as a team and part of what
the credit I want you to Tom as he had the dream team we had doctors nurses I
think we had a professional cook everybody on that trip was i justyou
know 10 * person in their own way and we we all had our differences but we work
so well together we have three commercial people that have been
commercial guys on there so they knew that you know that kind of routine and a camp and I mean it was just yeah so
but you know there’s that saying wherever you go there you are yeah and changing location doesn’t
change what’s going on internally and even on this dream trip I remember about
day two I started going down the rabbit hole again there were hikes I couldn’t
do scrambles I couldn’t do especially because I just couldn’t see and it was
too dangerous and I started going back into that dark place and even though I
tried to control that I’m in a situation like that it’s going to leak out you’re just too close and too
intertwined with everybody else and the leader of our group of guy named John
and Jimmy god I’ll never forget this morning of day for i learned i had to
get up early because it took me longer to pack and get everything done just
because it and I couldn’t see everything and I had to really set up my systems to
make sure you didn’t forget anything but I was packed early and John came up to
me and he said dog have a sense of what you’re going through and this is a guy
that he knows the river and he said three miles downriver left is a place
called Redwall cavern it’s a sacred place go there do whatever it is you
need to do and as he said that I’d like oh my god I’ve got this i have a destiny
with this place i have no idea what’s going to happen there but i have to go
there so i got my boat went down couldn’t miss it is cavern as post
because old block here in Nevada said he just carved out from the cliff
unbelievable plays sacred I pull my boat up on shore I took off my gear and I
just fell to my knees and I surrendered that was the beginning of the turning
point the experience I I think of it like vectors life vectors all my vectors
were added to a point life vectors and i created what that crossing is being
death literal death like that’s where i was going to die and that’s you know so
in that cavern those lines indeed showed up and I finally made it to that point
and I remember I mean I was screaming and raging and yelling and wave after
wave of stuff coming up slamming my fists into that the cliffs there until
the blood just releasing grief and anger and sadness and almost stopped it just
built up and remember finally I just yelled I just want to die why can’t I just die and then just like
that it cleared and on the other side of that
. was this spaciousness I’ve never known like if you carry a heavy load up like a
backpack up some really really steep trail that just is unrelenting and then
you get to the top and you take it off that feeling of light night yes yeah
that was the sensation except it was even bigger was an internal spaciousness
and lightness and all of a sudden that world have been so constricted and tight
and with no room for anything other than that crazy voice inside you know mine
made mental madness there was room for grief and sadness and anger but also for
hope and maybe Troy you know like imagine that
getting on with life and that was the turning point wow that’s a powerful story thank you
for being willing to share that we’re talking with Doug green about his
experiences with grief and suicide and thoughts and and glaucoma that’s
powerful thank you for sharing you know so you
made it through the river and it was just and it’s interesting to hear people
that have gone through just the experience of going down the colorado
river but being a life-changing trip for for many people and it was so profound
for you yeah it’s there were other experiences
to me it was Mariano’s this place called madcat nema cabin was like the throne
room of the Gods is the most beautiful place I’ve ever seen and there was sort
of i’m sure in my altered state to it like it may even deeper and then also
the big rapid is lava lava and I have a perfect run on it and i remember when i
got to the bottom that rapid Tom came up and he said you did it dug your dream of
running this river top-to-bottom like no no portaging top-to-bottom it’s going to
happen suit I was huge so I come off the river yeah once i got my God if the smoke the
bucket list right so the first if the first year could be so powerful without
even having a an intention of bringing any kind of life-altering thing to it i
mean the goal is to just get downloaded the river right now check it off your
back at ya back my last it’s that simple like what would be the possibilities of
actually bringing an intention to the second trip ok and so the second trip was to ride a
motorcycle solo for Mexico to King canada the Continental Divide I just
have to stop you for a minute sure you are blind that’s the first
thing I thought is that you know you have significant vision loss you know
how to just to clarify that because you do have significant vision loss but you
still have some fishing yeah so my world is like I wish I could
show you that the picture how I see the world but the imagine holding a toilet
or a paper towel tube up to your right eye i’m looking through that that’s what my
vision in my right eye is like in my left eye and it’s a bit better it’s having visions gone maybe
fifty-five percent but if you took a sheet of paper you were looking straight
ahead at the horizon line and you drop the sheet of paper right to the horizon
line from the top that’s what I basically have left I have
no vision above the horizon line pretty good vision left to right across the
midsection and then it’s a little bit is gone down below so that’s what my
visions like and the only guarantee is it won’t get better and it can be very
easily get worse so that’s what I’m left but i do have an efficient left to drive
for time because of that swath on my left eye that goes left to right a good
brain that peripheral vision but i have to be careful you know I don’t drive in
the big cities is not driving more difficult or actually in some ways it’s
easier because the hard part I don’t have the ability are peripheral
vision does such an incredible job of kind of filtering out automatically the stuff that we don’t need to pay
attention to but that’s in the stuff that we do need to pay attention to and
I don’t have that ability to filter stuff out so easily so i have to scan
constantly so at night all that visual noise drops down and then usually things
you have to be aware of removing or have a light on them right hopefully so ok so the next number two on your bucket
list he is the Continental Divide ride and
some friends of mine had done it well actually Tom I’m going to put me on the
Grand Canyon just on that ride just sounded like an incredible journey so I
wanted to do it alone and I wanted to do something to turn it into a growth full
trip and I searched around living in maroon at the time ask a few friends and
once it will want to do chakras you now make sense you’re going up the spine of
the country you want to be gone two months there are seven chakras you could
do a shocker per week it’s like yeah let’s do chakras so I got
a few books and won by on a date Judas call the eastern eastern eastern body
Western mind and turns out she was the partner from of one of the guys in my
men’s club I didn’t realize that at the time anyway
I did the shock was along the way and there’s survival sort of pleasure power
love voice vision and then sort of shock or seven which is that sort of the
theory online and third eye thing and I did I just hit the road with the books
we kind of do these exercises and then I’d open myself to the road say okay
we’ll bring me the experiences that I need to grow in this chakra as i’m
riding through these remote areas and going into these small towns and out in
the middle of no nowhere and once again the power of
surrender the experiences I had along the way we’re unbelievable shocker one I
ended up spending a week on of the ranch of a friend in pagosa springs colorado
all about Earth’s survival right are no nap chakra yeah that was the first
chakra second week pleasure i ended up at valley view hot springs in Colorado
and i met a woman who was just coming from a workshop in santa fe on chakras
actually ended up becoming involved shocker three power I mean you know each chakra along the
way had this its own power it was incredible and when was this at what point in your journey with you
know your eyesight loss of eyesight is about four months after the grand canyon
trip ok I jumped right in ch into the second
bucket list item that was I was doing anything else i still had some resources
i could drop into to do that and it was obvious way the time to do it yeah yeah so so two months later along
with 3-4 months and it took two months to do the trip the way I was doing it
and yeah and so and then you have your third yeah the third one’s a bigger Adam
what five six years of passenger side dishes did the second bucket list item
the third- to ride a motorcycle from Prudhoe Bay Alaska to Tierra del Fuego
Argentina basically as far north as you can go too far south as you can go on
Roseanne kind yeah and the north and south america and i want to bring
something to that to write some sort of growth some sort of that the the common
theme is there’s an outer adventure that provides a narrative for an internal
journey and this third one is going to be about
giving back and I want to raise awareness about vision issues possibly
depression trauma and right now I’ve been speaking a lot to lions clubs which
are about vision you know they’re Helen Keller challenge them back and i think
the nineteen twenties to like be the Knights to go out there and help people
with vision problems and they’re all over the world and they’re doing an
incredible talk about raising awareness and getting glasses two kids and areas
where they can’t get glasses and a lot of what they do is about vision so I
find them to be a really good group to align with so what has been your
experience with the grief process since you know since this i know you know it’s
not easy you know just eat you saw the light so to speak you came out of that
deep depression and grief and were able to get through that but it’s a life yeah it’s never ending right it’s you
have to be diligent i have gone down the rabbit hole a few times since then and
you’ve got a kind of be on top of it huh there were a few things that came out of
that so one was a couple books that i found especially powerful one was called
in an unspoken voice by Peter Levine the how the body wants to heal we don’t heal
on our heads talk therapy and all that stuff only get you so far real healing out it’s like you know you
see an animal get it like your dear gets attacked by a I don’t know if a lion and
survives cougar and it’s arrives it’s shakes itself you know an animal shake
that kind of trauma out of itself and then it just gets up and moves on with
his life we kind of have to do that same thing
that energy gets stuffed in us we hold it down it will manifest itself in other
ways and so that’s you know a we heal on our body more in our head to an incredible book by
viktor frankl called man’s search for meaning he was a psychologist in Austria
or psychiatrist get the two mixed up there was studying trauma and in pre
Nazi austria well not pronounce the pre-world War 2 the Nazis came in he was
captured he survived the death camps he lived in the death camps or three or
four years survived and watched others both Diane survivin he studied both
firsthand and through his observations what what is it that people would
survive have and those that don’t don’t and it wasn’t purpose they had something
bigger than themselves to drive them whether it was a piece of work they had
to create or family they wanted to reconnect with something bigger than
themselves that enable them to rise above and transcend their circumstances
so for me this trip and the work i do the book I wrote is all about finding
purpose in this and we don’t miss it I don’t believe that purpose necessarily
just comes to us out of the blue it’s something that maybe we just have to
create and for people in dark places sometimes it’s just a matter of like
getting through the day the stuff that’s coming at you rise above it deal with it keep moving forward because
you got to believe there’s something better on the other if you can keep
going if you don’t have that you know why I left and what was the purpose for
you was at the bucket list or was it something larger than that now i would
say the bucket list led me to it it’s to communicate this I mean I really they
say when your breath to the quickest way to get out of that depression is to go
out and help others right and our it’s really true and i really like speaking
getting this message out gives me I don’t know I just fulfills me in ways
to help others and raise awareness and get the conversation going there’s so
much stigma around depression suicide and darkness and to get just get the
conversation going so that people are more able to go out and help friends and
family get through this let them know they’re not alone is huge it’s huge I
mean that’s why we do disability wrap that’s why you know my life purpose with
working with people with disabilities and i think is also help me get to a
similar kind of . with my own disability through that purpose and finding meaning
in life and I think that it’s so true there’s so much stigma about these
topics how often do people talk about grief how often do people talk about
suicide you know I’m and i found this the irony
of of your bucket list and I know that’s just a piece it was a tool for you to
get where you’re at but it there’s I don’t know if you call it irony in it or
what have you but there’s so much stigma and they’re so often that people with
vision loss line complete line this physical disability mental health
disability I don’t care what it is are told oh you’ll never be able to do you know
whatever it is fill in the blank again and so the idea that you coming from you
know very well being around people be like oh you poor thing you’re never
gonna be able to drive or do those wonderful things that you used to won’t
do or you know be that adventurous spirit that you were anymore because of
it I mean that’s what people are told
subtly and not so subtly when they acquire a disability or you know live
with a disability so the idea of a bucket list is just kind of genius right
because I’m like yes you can still have your bucket list right regardless of who
you are what age you are what disability you have right it may look different and they feel a
little different that you once imagined you know whatever you have on your
bucket list but you can still have that bucket list I don’t care you know what your
limitations are sort of an aside but very related about 15 years ago I was
trekking in Nepal and i went up to Everest base camp and I happened to meet
a guy named pasquali he was an expedition leader on Everest and the
year before he had led what was arguably the most successful everest expedition
ever he got the first got most people on the summit one day the oldest person the
first father-and-son team but he’s also the one they got the blind person to the
summit yes and I had dinner with him what I
loved about Pascal nice he’s brash she’s almost like a swashbuckling Buccaneer
but he also totally gave credit said we did not halt this guy’s name is Eric
didn’t made it to the summit we didn’t Holly about that mountain he earned his
right to be on our team and I’ve since been in communication with Eric via
email he is an extraordinary person is totally
blind he summited Everest which I can’t even fathom and he’s also kayak down the
crayon canyon blowing I mean between the two climbing Everest and you know going
down the Grand Canyon kayaking blonde i would say the Grand Canyon’s the ordeal
really how my god i’m going to be on it it’s hard enough to fathom things when
you’re you know you have a kayak guy decided guide that he didn’t have one
but you know best you can do is over here when you’re high accuracy getting
pushed over and knocked down and as the water swirling and I can’t even imagine
what that would be like that so that’s there’s the cutting edge was possible
two minutes left yeah haha so i told you we needed a few
hours with you on the show because i really appreciate your love we can come
back and do part you’ve done well we will have that a promise so so with just a couple more minutes in
the show you know we’ve we’ve covered a lot of ground we’ve talked about you
know those things that are taboo topic from grief and depression and suicide
and and then you know living life with the disability so you know you’ve
written amazing bucks how do people learn more about you what you want
people to go away from the show that’s not a few things one get the book is
going to grief to grace and you go to from grief to grace calm but two is this
whole thing about stigma be there for friends be willing to have that
conversation it may bring up discomfort in you go
there anyway you’ll grow don’t bring your agenda to the person in trying to
help just be there just listen be a voice be
someone they can trust because they’re not going to hear you trying to fix them
just makes it worse right just be there and reach out be that
friend that’s so true don’t be afraid to have that
conversation with people yeah I’d say that unspoken feel the fear
and do it anyway well thank you so how can people learn
more about you are getting contact with you if they’d like to so why go to Doug
green author . com I think I still have to come and pull
out website together but Doug green there’s an e on the end of green the
green author calm and that’ll take you you can see more about work when we
speak about the book some of the projects i’m working on and then also I
actually do video as with a media company marketing videos and that’s Doug
green again and beyond the end of green and especially if you’ve got a
lion’s club or someplace where would be appropriate for me to speak I can
certainly do that excellent and the book is grief to grace
from grief to go from grief to grace is that green and check out from Greece to
Greece comments available on Amazon excellent well thank you so much tag you
can really was a pleasure having you on the show and thank you for talking about
these things that i know many listeners you know have experience with in one way
or another whether personally or through a family member friend and so so thank you for speaking the
unspoken yeah thanks and i gotta say i love this down below here an excuse to
come back up his great well we’ll have to come back and into a you know second
phase of the show with green so again that was green here on disability rap
disability rap happens the first friday of every month here on kvm rfm nevada
city k CPC camino

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